Mistakes in game design (whining newbie)

[THe Floating Brain]

Agreed

[pubby8]

EccentricDuck:
I agree with most of this.

jyscal1:
Yeah, I doubt anyone cared - after all they do have balls of steel. Still funny how getting new devs and pushing deadlines mattered much more for duke nukem forever than those many many many years of previous work.

xiphirx:
I will post more stuff, although I doubt it will suddenly cause anyone here to listen to me.
And this thread is more about game development than game design. The title is mistake.

Ginto:
N64vsSNES is who I was referring to. He is much more of a babbling moron than I am.
While I would enjoy holding respect here (and thus be taken seriously), I really doubt that it would change anything, as you all are very stubborn.

Van-B:
Arrogance is very common in game developers, and I do agree that it is very neccessary to have pride when doing things. I myself can be very arrogant, but I know it is not a neccessary trait and that it is best kept to a minimum. And besides, I bet even John Romero would say that gyrovorbis is being overly arrogant.

Yeah, I hate sharing code - you're always unhappy with some part of it, and you people pay more attention to the meaningless mistakes (as I did in that other thread) rather than to the parts you spent hours innovating+improving.

Notch is very rich man, but I would not say he's arrogant. Actually, notch hasn't made any of the mistakes I've talked about:
*he isn't calling himself better than anyone (if he did then someone else would come out with a faster, better, version to prove him wrong)
*he kept off hiring artist/team until after he made his money
*he refrains from talking with the community - for the most part
*he listens to critique. I know lots of things that have been changed because random suggestions.

TheBuzzSaw:
I honestly do not care for ES game - I never play RPGs,and don't own a dreamcast. Instead, I am here because of gyrovorbis - he pissed me off and I wanted to set him straight.

Yes, I do think they formed a team prematurely. For the sake of the game, an early team didn't help much.

Thanks for the name thing.

[dandymcgee]

LOL! I approve of the new rank!

ROFL, that is classic!

Lmao.

[XianForce]

There's your issue pubby, you're comparing the ES team to teams that are charging money. Because Notch is charging money for minecraft, he is making a game for the PLAYERS. The ES Team is making a game for themselves. I think I am accurate in saying that they, for the most part, don't give a crap about our opinion. They want to make the game how THEY want it, not how WE want it. And how does it make sense to hold off on hiring artists until AFTER you've made money? I sure as hell won't pay money for a game filled with "programmer art". I'm quite sure many feel the same way.

[k1net1k]

i think one point here that is missing is that this game was intended to be made by falco and marcel, and they would be stoked if their friends could play it. it turned into a lot more. I think the dev process, and uploading it to youtube is what 90% of the audience enjoy, not the possibility of a finished game (although that looks possible)

[pubby8]

The ES Team is making a game for themselves.

Gyrovorbis says this? There are probably many motivations for making ES, it would be rather sad if they are doing it 100% for theirself.

I think I am accurate in saying that they, for the most part, don't give a crap about our opinion.

They care a lot about opinions that support them and, so they should also care about critique.

They want to make the game how THEY want it, not how WE want it.

As any game developer should - democracy sucks.

And how does it make sense to hold off on hiring artists until AFTER you've made money? I sure as hell won't pay money for a game filled with "programmer art".

I never said that you should wait until you have made sales, I only said you should not start art very early on.

i think one point here that is missing is that this game was intended to be made by falco and marcel, and they would be stoked if their friends could play it. it turned into a lot more. I think the dev process, and uploading it to youtube is what 90% of the audience enjoy, not the possibility of a finished game (although that looks possible)

Yes, although you must admit that I am sure the team would much rather be known as the guys who "made a great game" than the "clowns who fooled around on youtube"

[N64vSNES]

LOL! I approve of the new rank!

It suits him!

N64vsSNES is who I was referring to. He is much more of a babbling moron than I am.
While I would enjoy holding respect here (and thus be taken seriously), I really doubt that it would change anything, as you all are very stubborn.

Oh stop! I'm blushing!

[Firzen]

While I would enjoy holding respect here (and thus be taken seriously), I really doubt that it would change anything, as you all are very stubborn.

I will just say something about this real quick.
Imagine you are walking along the road like you normally do and suddenly someone walks up to you and tells you that you are walking wrong.
How would you react?
This has nothing to do with stubbornness. You are a stranger here and you certainly have not left the best first impression. We do not listen to you because you have not shown any sign of validity or reliability. We are not being stubborn, we just want to know who you are and what you are capable of before taking any advice.

You wouldn't take advice of some random person you meet on the street if they can not show their credibility. If a bank manager told you stuff about finances you might listen but not when you are talking to a compelte stranger and have no idea about him.

[Falco Girgis]

And any stranger who DOES believe that his word should be taken seriously without providing credentials IS arrogant.

Pubby8, you are honest-to-god far more arrogant than I am. Sure, I am extremely confident in my field. Perhaps even "arrogant." But I would NEVER swagger my ass into some other community, provide 0 credentials or reason to be given respect and proclaim my opinions word of god. You are the epitome of ignorant arrogance.

[pritam]

Trying to convince an entire community of intelligent people to accept useless ideals.

[TheBuzzSaw]

Gyrovorbis says this? There are probably many motivations for making ES, it would be rather sad if they are doing it 100% for theirself.

I defy you to defend this statement. This is one of the dumber things you've said in this discussion.

[Falco Girgis]

Gyrovorbis says this? There are probably many motivations for making ES, it would be rather sad if they are doing it 100% for theirself.

I defy you to defend this statement. This is one of the dumber things you've said in this discussion.

No joke. 99% of our motivation is our own passion and pursuit of knowledge. Quit pretending to know us or our motives, pubby.

[pubby8]

@Firzen:
Yes, I suppose so, however I would not call ourselves complete strangers now.

@Gyrovorbis:
Please explain.
I have given credientials and you had known of me before this topic. Stop being silly and saying that I am coming from nowhere.
Never once did I refer to myself as a god (although it is nice to go from "babbling moron with no argument" to "arrogant guy who ignorantly thinks he is god")

@Pritam:
Trying to prove to some random person that ES is worth something.

@TheBuzzSaw:
I consider these to be seperate motivations:
*Yourself playing/enjoying the game (this is what I refer to as "Making a game for themselves")
*Other people playing/enjoying the game
*Learning
*Making money
*Achieving something in life
Everything we do (when given chance) we do 100% for ourself - we both misunderstood what other person meant.

[pritam]

@Pritam:
Trying to prove to some random person that ES is worth something.

pubby trying to push useless ideals to random people.

And I'm not trying to prove ES for you, I couldn't care less for your opinion about something you don't know much about.

[TheBuzzSaw]

Yes, I suppose so, however I would not call ourselves complete strangers now.

So, if that guy who told you that you walk wrong sat and chatted with you for 5 minutes, you'd then trust him enough? You're an idiot.

@TheBuzzSaw:
I consider these to be seperate motivations:
*Yourself playing/enjoying the game (this is what I refer to as "Making a game for themselves")
*Other people playing/enjoying the game
*Learning
*Making money
*Achieving something in life
Everything we do (when given chance) we do 100% for ourself - we both misunderstood what other person meant.

What's your point?